Mohr Philosophy Forum

Drought of 2013

duncan — Mon, 02 Mar 2009 20:44:46 GMT

I think about these lyrics from time to time in the context of the global economic "down-turn" that we're ourselves in. Not in the sense of water, of course. And, in particular, the last verse.

"In 2010 I took her in and said Id love her till the sky has lost her blue and the rivers all run still. Followed her till she came in and put her hand in mine.
Then we lived in green fields but now its just a shame. Cities which once grew like weeds, now shipwrecks on the plain. 750 days since a drop of rain.
Then came November and my lover hid up rye. Drank it in the swelter as she laughed as the red sun died. She said she was gonna leave me and head out to the sea-side. Catch a cloud and ride. Never such a thing.
Politicians blamed each other. The preachers swelled with pride. The wealthy killed each other and the poor gave up a smile. Cause 750 days without a drop of rain made everyone the same.

Hello Out There

Darren — Thur, 04 Dec 2008 01:20:15 GMT

I doubt that many are still listening but I decided to share anyway. If you have a couple of hours to burn then please check this out:

http://www.wts.edu/flash/media_popup/media_player.php?id=462&paramType=video

Religion, ethics, physics, philosophy, etc... all rolled into one very respectful and intelligent discussion.... I liked it anyway.

Take Care All,

Darren

kinda off topic

robert ruff — Sat, 20 Sep 2008 07:40:00 GMT

I know this isn't really a site about the band but saw them tonight in Anaheim and it was great as usual. the opening act was kinda strange though. i have always wanted to open for bhtm but havn't got the chance. i think we would fit well. what do u think? http://www.myspace.com/andersonhall

Walt Whitman on pbs

Cindy — Thur, 17 Apr 2008 16:49:41 GMT

Did anyone catch this fantastic "American Experience" show? If not you can watch it online: http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/amex/whitman/

philosophy of songwriting lyrics

hawkeye mike — Sat, 12 Apr 2008 17:55:12 GMT

Many of us post or lurk here because we know of Todd from his music. Id like to introduce a songwriting topic that seeks to combine music and philosophy; or at least the philosophy of songwriting. Allow me to elaborate.

First, please accept that I have zero songwriting ability. As such, I marvel at those who have this ability. All that follows is offered from merely a music fan, rather than from someone with musical talent, with formal training or even a modest education regarding songwriting.

The theory is that over time, inevitably, songwriters will include more and more words in each song as compared to his or her early work. It might even be possible to statically test this theory by measuring the number of words, or syllables even, per minute or bar for a relevant sample of artists. Seems like a good dissertation topic for music majors or a statistics major who loves music. Ah, to attend college again and enjoy such pursuits. Alas, I digress. Allow me to get back on track.

Counting words is not good indicator of a quality song. There will be no causal link between the number of words and a songs appeal, I assert. A good song can possess either volumes of lyrics or very few. The theory that a songwriter will over his or her career become increasing lyrical is merely something I believe based upon unscientific observation. Nevertheless I find this theory worthy of exploration.

If there is truly an evolution toward increasingly lyrical-laced songs over ones songwriting career, it could be fueled by some general themes or influenced by diverse topics including;

Aging, or the wisdom that comes with it, motivating one to say more via lyrics.
An artist may over time develop stronger preferences (as we seem to do with age I suppose) making him or her write from an increasingly didactical position that merely requires more lyrics and words to make the point.
Over time a songwritings sense of creative freedom might increase and the artist may have a preference to write more lyrics and have less open spaces for melody.
The influence of rap or hip hop on other genres such as folk, pop, blues, contemporary pop or alternative contemporary pop, given that much of rap or hip hop would be the most lyrically dense music around.
Songwriters tend to be the vocalist as well. Is it possible that the creative process becomes increasingly focused on the singers voice as an instrument as compared to the band?
Perhaps lyrics are more coveted by radio-friendly pop? As a result, there is pressure on an artist to compress songs to a singles format thereby sacrificing some of the bars that contain only instrumentation. We all know from 70s FM radio that the only time we heard a song over five minutes was late at night when the DJ was alone needed to micturate. Moreover, the American Idol judges are not going to think a contestant has chosen well his or her music if instead of singing he or she is toe tapping for 45 seconds waiting for the next point to come in.

The most salient example of this theory is, when looking over my personal CD collection, Pink Floyd and Neil Young. If one charts Pink Floyd from inception, through the period when Roger Waters increases his creative influence in the band, it seems obvious that lyrics became increasingly pervasive. Compare Wish You Where Here to The Final Cut. Then, after The Final Cut, when the songwriting falls to David Gilmour, one finds a return to melody and open spaces within the music. U2 might be another good example as Bono seems to be singing before the music even starts and after it ends these days.

Again, a good song is not made or lost on the number of lyrics. Further, Im not offering commentary on Todds work as Im not sure the theory fits his impressive body of work. I do tend to like music where the lyrics are a bit subtle (that does not mean abstract or overly abstract, by the way) and the musical melody compliments the songs mood. Sometimes a song with an economy of lyrics can speak volumes. It is to me like when an actor can communicate rage with only a motionless facial expression. Eastwood is not a good actor per se, but think of his sneering face in just about any of his moves. Compare this to Pulp Fiction when Butch was tearing the hotel room apart over losing his fathers watch. Both philosophies regarding emoting rage are effective, and yet each has a style on to itself.

It would be wonderful to explore this further and to read the thoughts of this group. Bless you all.

Hawkeye Mike

'08 Tour

John — Sat, 16 Feb 2008 01:09:17 GMT

Why oh why are you not coming to Houston this year? Please work it in.

The politics of art.

Darren — Fri, 04 Jan 2008 17:56:02 GMT

I am not a political preacher and believe strongly that music is supposed to unite people rather than divide. - TPM

I found this a curious quote from the BHTM message board that got me considering my own opinions on the matter. I would have to say that I disagree and would question the desire to define so strongly a supposed role for music or any other art form. In the more defined context of art from the perspective of the artist I can see a rightful desire to direct ones own art toward whatever purpose intended. In a broader sense I see art as necessarily being freed from the bonds of any defined purpose.

Some of my very favorite pieces of music have been aimed at confronting political differences and for many must represent an intended statement of divisiveness. Consider examples from Viet Nam/Hippie era music.

Tin soldiers and Nixon coming,
Were finally on our own.
This summer I hear the drumming,
Four dead in Ohio.

Gotta get down to it
Soldiers are gunning us down
Should have been done long ago.
What if you knew her
And found her dead on the ground
How can you run when you know?

- Neil Young

Paranoia strikes deep.
Into your life it will creep.
It starts when you're always afraid.
Step out of line, the men come and take you away.
You better stop.
Hey, what's that sound?
Everybody look what's goin' down.

- Stephen Stills

One might ague that these were lyrics designed to be a source of unity to the anti-war position but to the establishment they were unquestionably divisive and sought only to take sides.

Even todays muse is rife with lyrics of division as a response to the polarity of our present political landscape.

Who'll be the last to die for a mistake
The last to die for a mistake
Whose blood will spill, whose heart will break
Who'll be the last to die

- Bruce Springsteen

Don't wanna be an American Idiot
Don't want a nation under the new mania
can you hear the sound of hysteria?
The subliminal mind-fuck America
Welcome to a new kind of tension

All across the alienation
Where everything isn't meant to be OK
Television dreams of tomorrow
We're not the ones who are meant to follow
For that's enough to argue

Well, maybe I'm the faggot America
I'm not a part of a redneck agenda
Now everybody do the propaganda
And sing along to the age of paranoia

-Billy Joe Armstrong

I personally believe that art thrives on its potential to be whatever it may be interpreted to be. Despite even the expressed intent of an artist there is nothing to prevent any consumer of art to interpret or even misinterpret in whatever way he chooses. A song or a poem intent on unity may become an anthem of divisiveness in the hands of the masses. I applaud the musical art form in all its varied manifestations. The ability of a church hymn to unify is just as appropriate as an overt political message may be apt to divide.

Each artist will determine the intent of his own message. Suffice to say that where one is divisive he risks dividing his own potential audience. Clearly as Springsteen proposes death as mistake he is just as divisive as Toby Keith while intoning a boot is your ass being the American Way. In either case each artist limits his appeal to a segment of society as a whole. I understand completely the desire of an artist that his art not build fences but I would also like to celebrate the ability of free artistic expression to build fences, to boldly illustrate difference and to inspire heated debate.

Darren

The blogger breathes.

Darren — Wed, 02 Jan 2008 22:36:12 GMT

Okay so someone tweaked the blog..... Is there about to be life here again?

The political season is ripe for conversation.

Are you inspired?

Darren

Simon Schama's 'Power of Art'

duncan — Mon, 05 Nov 2007 01:06:51 GMT

Not sure if any of you had the chance to catch this series when they aired it on PBS. I happened to catch the last episode on Rothko and ended up buying the DVD set. It's fantastic. I recommend it to anyone interested in these things.

In short, I highlights eight artists and key works by each:

It's very well done and I enjoy Schama's delivery and perspective quite a bit.

Here are a few links:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/arts/powerofart/

http://www.pbs.org/previews/simonschama-powerofart/

Article in Rolling Stone

Cindy — Tue, 23 Oct 2007 20:31:30 GMT

This is by James Lovelock, the guy who came up with the Gaia theory:
http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/story/16956300/the_prophet_of_climate_change_james_lovelock

Bishop John Shelby Spong in Denver

Emily — Thur, 11 Oct 2007 22:51:41 GMT

Lecture Series Nov. 16-18
Montview Presbyterian Church
1980 Dahlia Street
Denver, CO

Nov. 16 lecture free & open to the public
http://www.montview.org

Omnivore's Dilema

Emily — Mon, 17 Sep 2007 14:38:56 GMT

Anyone read this? An amazing & profound look at the simple question of where our food comes from, and what are the implications of the choices we make. Beautifully written by Michael Pollan - it sent me into a tailspin.

Those were the days.......

Darren — Sat, 15 Sep 2007 20:08:28 GMT

It seems our dialog here has all but died. It is a sad reality in my opinion. I miss the vibrant and meaningful discussions of months past. I know Todd is busy. I am busy myself. I am always busy. This message board and our discussions once forced me to make time for discussions and deeper thoughts that I now miss and cherish. I truly feel I have benefited from the time I have spent here and hope it will flourish and reawaken in our collective futures.

So Todd. Are you still checking in from time to time? A simple yes would suffice. What did you think of the book I gave you back in January? Here is a link for you but really for ALL of you that want to listen to someone speak who cant help but make you feel good. http://www.pointofinquiry.org/?p=127. The speaker (Paul Kurtz) is a Professor Emeritus of Philosophy at the State University of New York at Buffalo. His particular brand of philosophy is near and dear to my heart. I have posted here in the past concerning a school of thought labeled as Secular Humanism.. Paul Kurtz is a very clear voice on the subject that I wanted to share. Give it a listen. I hope you like it.

Take Care All (and I hope we can speak more again soon.)